39th PARLIAMENT, 2nd SESSION
EDITED HANSARD • NUMBER 053
CONTENTS
Monday, February 25, 2008

Afghanistan

Mr. Ed Komarnicki (Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration, CPC):

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with my colleague from Saskatoon—Humboldt.

I am quite pleased to join in this important debate on the future of the Afghan mission. I believe this is not a time to shrink back, as some would have it, as we move to a pivotal moment in the future of Afghanistan. Pulling back or pulling out at a moment that requires one to go forward and commit would be a colossal error. When the scales are about to tip, or have just tipped, a greater effort and more resolve is required to tip them in the right direction. This is that time, this is that hour. It is a time of going forward and not shrinking back.

This is why I am happy to see there is some fundamental common ground between the government and the official opposition on the continuation of the mission until 2011. To have left in 2009 would have been cutting and running. It would not be something that would be conducive to what would need to happen. The House cannot abandon the Afghan people, as some have suggested. We need to continue advancing security, development and governance.

Canadians have asked honest questions like why are we in Afghanistan? War is never easy, not for the troops and not for Canadians themselves.

I respond by saying we need to remember why we are in Afghanistan and what it is we hope to accomplish. Canada was invited by the Afghan government, a democratically elected government, along with 36 other nations as part of a UN-sanctioned, NATO-led mission. We were committed to Kandahar, which is the most troubled region in Afghanistan, by a previous government. Through a vote in the House, in which we all had an opportunity to participate, we honoured and extended that commitment.

We should also remember that we are not there solely for the benefit of Afghans, but also for the benefit of Canada and Canadians.

The brutal reality of September 11 serves as a reminder that no country is immune from the threat of terrorism. Canadians died the day the twin towers came down. If we choose to live in a false sense of security, pretending all is well and ignoring the reality of what happened on 9/11 or who was behind it, we will ultimately come to regret it.

We must take the fight to the enemy, but this responsibility is not ours alone. It is the responsibility of all peace-loving nations as a whole and we must share in that responsibility. Ultimately the people of Afghanistan have that responsibility as well.

The independent panel on Canada's future role on Afghanistan, led by former deputy prime minister John Manley, said in its report:

A primary Canadian objective, while helping Afghans, has been to help ensure that Afghanistan itself does not again revert to the status of sanctuary and head office for global terrorism.

We must remain committed to the people of Afghanistan to 2011 to provide sufficient time for Afghans to ready themselves to shoulder the responsibility of security and governance. Canada has always stepped up to the plate for our international obligations.

Canada has a long history of proving our commitment to international peace and stability, whether in World Wars I and II, Korea, the former Yugoslavia, or today in Afghanistan. Our mission in Afghanistan is in keeping with this history, while maintaining a balance of policy needs like security, governance and development. Canada has a responsibility as a leader in the international community to step up when the need calls.

We cannot focus on every conflict in the world, but when we do act, we must act decisively and with purpose. If we are to be involved with a conflict, we must put in a determined effort. It must be real, it must be substantial and it must be with an eye to victory. We began by rebuilding the military and updating its equipment, but as the Manley report indicated, specific steps needed to be taken with respect to Afghanistan.

The Manley panel recommended that Canada's role in Afghanistan should give greater emphasis to diplomacy, reconstruction and governance and that the military mission should shift increasingly toward the training of Afghan National Security Forces.

The motion before us today reflects these recommendations, which the Prime Minister broadly accepted.

The motion states that the House is to take note that the ultimate aim of Canadian policy is to leave Afghanistan to Afghans. Our goal is to help build a country that is better governed, more peaceful and more secure. We aim to create the necessary space and conditions to allow the Afghans themselves to achieve a political solution to the conflict.

To achieve that aim, it is essential to assist the people of Afghanistan to have properly trained, equipped and paid members of the four pillars of their security apparatus: the army, the police, the judicial system and the correctional system.

We are making progress in these areas as well. For instance, more Afghan battalions are up and running than last year. Every month that goes by, they are better trained to provide security for the communities that are trying to live in peace and to raise their children. Our goal is to let Afghans defend and govern themselves.

Canada is helping to reform the Afghan justice system, to promote human rights and allow for better protection of its citizens. Consider this, Canada directly supports the training of more than 70 prosecutors, 68 public defenders and more than 200 judges. Having a judicial system that works and operates, sets the checks and balances and the foundations necessary for a society to succeed.

Over 600 Afghan national police have received training through the provincial reconstruction team. Canada is a major contributor to the international Law and Order Trust Fund that pays the salaries of over 60,000 policemen in all 34 provinces of Afghanistan. We have helped construct police stations and checkpoints to help improve local security.

Let us not forget what the motion calls for. It says that Canada should continue a military presence in Kandahar beyond February 2009 to July 2011 in a manner fully consistent with the UN mandate on Afghanistan. This means we will continue training Afghan national security forces so they can assume responsibility for their own security. Security means development can happen. Security means democracy can flourish.

To quote the Manley report, “security enables development; effective governance enhances security; development creates opportunities, and multiplies the rewards, of improved security and good governance”.

Security is an essential condition of good governance and lasting development, but this continued involvement must have what it needs to meet the goal. We are our making the commitment conditional on NATO providing us with a battle group of 1,000 soldiers. As well, our soldiers need medium to heavy lift helicopters and unmanned aerial vehicles for intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance. I know the government is working hard to meet these requirements.

The motion is not an open-ended commitment and neither is it without condition. It defines the extent and duration of Canada's commitment that is consistent with Canadian's hearts and minds on this matter. To date we have carried an enormous part of the load in the most difficult part of the country. As the Prime Minister has said, Canadians want us to make a positive difference in a dangerous world. In Afghanistan we are making that difference.

We must remember that terrorism remains a threat to global peace and security. Afghanistan has been used as a base for terrorism in the past. In the interest of our collective security, Canada and its international partners share a responsibility. In the end, we must provide the people of Afghanistan with the hope for a brighter future by establishing the security necessary to promote development and an environment that is conducive to improve Afghan lives.

Rebuilding a shattered Afghanistan is a slow and complex process in a country that is emerging from more than two decades of human rights abuses, terror, conflict, drought and poverty. That responsibility is not ours alone. It is the responsibility of all peace-loving nations and everyone must play their part in a determined way.

I urge all members of the House to support this motion so we can continue the important job of helping to rebuild Afghanistan.

Hon. Keith Martin (Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, Lib.):

Mr. Speaker, I have a couple of comments to make. I think we should all be very careful in our expectations.

First, Afghanistan is an Islamic republic. It is a feudal, tribal Islamic republic. We will not turn it around into a democratic, secular, human rights embracing nation. It just will not happen, unless we want to be there for generation after generation. If we were, we would be seen as occupiers and the insurgency would make matters worse.

Second, on the issue of al-Qaeda, all the battles that we will fight in Afghanistan, all the reconstruction that we will do there will make almost no difference whatsoever to al-Qaeda. Al-Qaeda is an international diffuse organization with no titular head. It is a diffuse movement all over the world. If we were really interested in dealing with al-Qaeda, which incidentally left a few short weeks after 9/11 and it by and large left the country before we even got there, then we have to deal with some difficult and tricky issues such as Saudi Arabia, repressive, thuggish regimes in the Middle East, the lack of resolution to Israel and Palestine and not having two states side by side with 67 borders. We have to deal with those things in order to address al-Qaeda as well as putting money into our own domestic surveillance mechanisms and strengthening our role in Interpol and others.

The member made some good points on corruption. Will he ask his government, when it goes to Bucharest, to put much greater pressure on our allies to support adequate pay for the civil service in Afghanistan, as well as the pay for the Afghan police, army, judiciary and corrections and that they also receive the equipment they need and adequate training?

Unless the civil service is paid adequately, the people will resort to bribes and petty crimes to survive. That kind of endemic corruption will not go away unless the people have adequate pay and also an adequate governance structure. I suggest Canada could make a very strong, positive impact on the future of Afghanistan by using our extraordinary tools within Canada. We are an exceptional country that could provide the governance solutions required in other countries, to train other countries to have a good public service.

This is something in which I firmly believe. Our country could play a very effective role if we were to use the tools that we have within our own country to enable Afghan people to build up their own capacity in governance as well as in primary health, education and economic development.

Mr. Ed Komarnicki:

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the hon. member indicating that expectations should not be set very high, but we should have expectations nonetheless.

Incredibly, if we look at the history of what has happened in a short period of time, there has been progress. I know it is important to have various capacity building foundations to ensure the ability is there to succeed. I know in the judiciary having prosecutors and defence counsel, including judges, are fairly important aspects and that has been ongoing and going forward.

Payment has been made. I appreciate that the member wants to ensure it is adequate. However, one thing is for sure. Leaving as early as 2009 would not have left them in a position where Afghans would have the ability to succeed.

However, the progress that I do see is significant. It would be unthinkable just a few years ago to imagine what has happened to date. For example, a new Afghan constitution has restored the rule of law with respect to the human rights of every Afghan citizen, including women and children. The Afghan people now vote. Women and girls have rights and children go to school. There are reports on what those statistics are and they are encouraging.

There is no doubt they need to have the infrastructure, the capacity and the governance structure to succeed, but we have to be there as that grows. By extending this mission and ensuring the protection and nurturing of that, at some point it needs to take root and it needs to be the responsibility of the Afghan people to take it to its ultimate conclusion.

TOP